TIM BAKER:
Welcome to the Center for Data Science Admissions podcast. I’m your host, Tim Baker.
STEPHEN ROY: Stephen Roy. I am now going into my second year as a Masters student at the NYU Center for Data Science. Pretty much coming back from work and getting ready to work on a higher degree education so that I can continue progressing in my job.
TIM BAKER: OK. Was it the first time that you applied for the program for the Fall 2019 class?
STEPHEN ROY: Yeah. I actually only applied to two programs. Some of that was, some of the constraints that I was looking at, I wanted to be in my home state of New York. I was trying to find places that weren’t exactly where I grew up, that were a little further away. And really NYU was one of the better fits for me which is why it was my first choice when I was looking for it. Had a solid background, at least from the research I could do of it being a data science program, one of the older ones, and definitely some of the more prestigious teachers at the moment, and that’s one of the large driving factors for me when I was looking at programs.
TIM BAKER: OK. So when you’re putting your application process together, how did you find the application process? Was it tedious? Was it relatively straightforward?
STEPHEN ROY: I don’t have a huge basis of comparison because I really only filled out two different application programs. It wasn’t bad. I really don’t have a lot of insights for it. I think most of it was managed by the graduate school, not necessarily CDS. There were a few things that I think may not jump out to somebody, just reflecting on it now. One of those is that probably the only area, CDS, the Center for Data Science, really controls is the track tapping and that is something that you do actually declare in the application. And I think that that’s something that I pretty much got lucky when I was picking because I did end up with what I consider to be a better track, at least one that aligns more with my interests, not necessarily saying anything about any of the others. But there’s a lot of uncertainty that might go in. And while I’m sure you can change your track, your track around once you actually get to the program, it wouldn’t be too difficult, I don’t think many people will do that or I don’t think that’s common.
Most people, I feel, kind of get that sunk costs. Well, I’ve made my choice so I’m going with it. And perhaps something that be a little better communicated in the application but when going through it, it’s a standard application. You put in the things they ask you for, you upload the things they ask you for, and you send out some links so people can upload their recommendations or whatever they wanna write on your behalf.
TIM BAKER: Cool. I’m glad you brought up the track. You’re actually the first person I’ve interviewed in two years who has brought up the tracks in the application.
STEPHEN ROY: (LAUGHS)
TIM BAKER: So, students can actually change within their first year. But, you know, like you said, it’s not something that people are flocking to. But the option is there. Have any advice for students or applicants that are putting together an application, things that you think might help them be successful?
STEPHEN ROY: Well, I certainly have no groundbreaking insights. Everything that I’ve said, I’m sure somebody else has said before. Probably the more important side is how you are writing and what you are writing when you’re putting together your letter of intent and when you’re asking people for recommendations.
The only thing that I did that may be less common, I’m honestly not sure. The last time I applied for a college degree was my undergrad back in 2007, so it’s been a while. But when I was sending out and requesting people to write letters of recommendation, I know I sent them—I’m pretty sure nobody actually used it—but I sent them a fairly tailored letter of recommendation. The things that I remembered of working with them and for the one who taught me, learning under them. And that was probably be the most time-consuming part of my application was trying to think back over the history of people who had taught me 10, 11 years ago. In the best case, it was somebody I had worked with two years ago. But trying to think about who would actually have a good idea of how I would mesh with the program rather than just picking a boss or somebody I’d worked with last year. I was really putting a little bit of effort into that part of the application.
TIM BAKER: That’s a great advice. So, transitioning from the application, you came to CDS, your background is very interesting especially compared with a lot of our other students. Would you mind sharing a little bit about that?
STEPHEN ROY: Sure. So, as already alluded to, I have been working for quite a few years. Specifically, I’m in the US Army. I’ve been doing telecommunications signal, if you’re familiar. Mainly just working communication networks around the world. I was in Germany for about four and a half years. Then I went to the Middle East. Germany was all satellite communications. The Middle East I was managing a data center and doing terrestrial communications. Most recently, I was back at Fort Bragg with the 82nd jumping out of planes and having a good old time hanging down there and in the heat of the south. So, most of it has been a lot of traveling, a lot of seeing the world, a lot of learning new things and having experiences, which I think has been very beneficial for me.
From the question of why data science, why did I pick this particular program? I already knew that I was going to be trying to change a little bit of my career tapping. I’m sort of at the point where I really am becoming more of a manager and less of an operator when it comes to the things I will do on a day to day basis. And I wanted to get back into a little bit more of doing something rather than directing something role. And one of the ways that I did that is by trying to change paths out of telecommunications and into operational research. So there’s a operational research and systems analysis component in the Army, and that is what I’m moving into. So, part of that is very data science, heavy and driven, and already being at the point where it really behooves me to look at a higher than bachelor’s degree, graduate degree. Now was about the best timing I had to marry those two efforts together.
TIM BAKER: OK. And how did you find the transition from going from life in the military to life at CDS?
STEPHEN ROY: Uhm, yeah. It’s a fairly big transition. For starters, the most of the cohort is much younger and you get used to… For some odd reason, all the older folks lock together pretty quick on. You recognize who the old folks are and you kind of clump together early on. But there is much more flexibility in how you wanna spend your time and what activities you want to pursue and what projects you wanna get into. And really, it does become a lot of seeking out your own destiny from a CDS standpoint. If you want to find a mentor or find a teacher, find somebody who you really admire or your interests align, you can get tied to them and learn a lot and do projects beyond just what you’re doing in class very easily. If you just wanna get the degree, skate by. You’re here, you’re trying to find a job, that’s your focus, there is plenty of time for that. There are plenty of resources for that. Loraine does a great job of trying to give people ideas and places where they can begin the job hunt process.
But the biggest difference is that, was for me, that most of the choices I would make on a day-to-day basis were fully under my own control. I mean, even as far as do I even go to class today? Yeah, I’m gonna go to class. But that’s something that you wouldn’t have somebody breathing down your neck if you decided there was something more important that day you had to take care of.
TIM BAKER: Before we came to CDS, you had mentioned that your home state is New York, but did you live in New York City at all before coming to CDS?
STEPHEN ROY: Not the city, no. The larger cities that I’ve lived in prior to here were Kuwait City and Augusta, Georgia, which neither really… I mean, Kuwait City is pretty close to the feel of New York in many places. But no, I was all upstate, kind of in the capital region area. Grew up on a farm before joining the military. And while I’ve lived many places, New York City has one of the more interesting dynamics out of all of those.
TIM BAKER: So, how did you find living in New York? How long did it take you to get accustomed to life in New York City?
STEPHEN ROY: You know, getting accustomed is an interesting question, especially in light of the current pandemic and all that shenanigans. I would say that I found getting into a routine, getting settled, to be fairly easy, because I tend to move every couple of years. It’s straightforward. I know my routine. I don’t have a lot of possessions, so I can just move in somewhere and be up and running and that’s easy. I think that from a lifestyle standpoint, the biggest change by far is that I don’t drive around nearly as much as I used to.
I still have my car. It costs about $200 a month to get a parking spot and keep it. But yeah, the biggest difference is I don’t really drive around as much. And honestly, I probably don’t eat as healthy as I used to because I don’t drive to a grocery store and get food and come back. I’ll have a lot more delivery food just like Amazon or Pantry or Walmart or whatever your particular delivery service of choice is. And usually they don’t deliver fresh foods. So I find myself probably eating a little less healthy, a lot more rice and oatmeal based than fresh fruits and veggies. Getting into a routine, I didn’t find it too terribly difficult but I put a lot of that based on previous experiences.
TIM BAKER: OK. And so for somebody coming to New York for the first time, can you sort of describe the housing process, things that you would recommend somebody does when they’re looking for housing?
STEPHEN ROY: Sure. I will begin by prefacing that the first thing you probably wanna do is narrow down what areas you want to commute from because commuting is going to be the most troublesome or enjoyable part of your day for a lot of folks. And figuring out what is an easy way to get to CDS, because while we may or may not be full time or hybrid model when folks come in, I’m sure later down the road we will be full time and back to a normal school environment. Finding that commuting and home that is easy and safe and reliable is a big part. So that was the first thing that I personally did, was looked. OK, what are the easy avenues, the easy ways to get into CDS every day and into the NYU campus?
And the NYU campus is pretty big. So that could be several different blocks or places that you may go to. What I ended up settling on was very different than many though. I fell into, broadly speaking, there are kind of like two camps. There’s the New York side and then there’s the New Jersey side of students. And the New York side will subdivide themselves more into OK, the folks who go down to Brooklyn, the folks who go up in like Astoria, the people who stay in or around CDS. But for most of the New Jersey folks, we all pretty much use the path transit which is a subway that just runs right into New Jersey. And if you live in New Jersey, probably the easiest way to get in and out. I’ll have roughly a 30-35 minute commute that drops me off right about a block and a half away from the CDS building. And that will be my first stop pretty much every day when I come in. I’ll just go in, be there, and then head out.
So the first thing I’d iron down is your transportation. Well, how long do you want to spend commuting in and out? And once you figure out how long you’re willing to spend, that will limit the areas that you should even begin looking for housing. Then standard housing. Look at price, look at the amenities you care about. I personally cared about internet, noise, and the ability to go out and go running, because I really enjoy running. And once you find that, you only have a few places to go and look at. The amenities you choose and the location are really going to narrow it down. If you know somebody in the area, that certainly does help, because there are some intricacies, especially on the New York side. A little less so on the New Jersey side of dealing with brokers and looking at different fees that there may be.
I hate to say thism because this won’t be as useful to people who don’t know anyone in the area. But if you do know people living nearby, reach out to them. They may be able to share some experiences or tips specific to the neighborhood you’re looking at. But yeah, ask people once you’ve narrowed it down to that area, if it is a good area, if they enjoy living there and if they have anything that they would recommend not doing or not living because it’s, yeah, where you live is going to be a huge part of your experience and the… (INAUDIBLE) it is for you and if you have roommates, which many people will have, the better it will be. Hopefully you do not fall into the trap where you end up having to move because of personality conflicts. You and a roommate or somebody don’t get along with each other. Those are some things I would put into consideration, not very succinctly put, but my thoughts at least.
TIM BAKER: Excellent. There’s actually… You’re the first person that has mentioned the transportation, how important that is. So, as a longtime New York City resident, I concur that transportation is one of the most important aspects of your life in this area, so well done.
STEPHEN ROY: Know the metro, knowing the bus routes. There are certainly, not all are created equal. Some are more reliable, some only run during certain times of the day. And depending on your schedule a lot of our classes, at least if you’re in the CDS department, are late at night, they’re in the evenings. And that will change what you see as far as your travel options. When you have to fit 100, you know, 100 people is kind of a largest class you’ll run into, about 100 people and some of those are working full time jobs and school part time. So you try and accommodate them into the academic schedule. That means you may have your last class of the day be at 6:00 pm Eastern going until 8:00 pm Eastern. And then you’ve got to find a way to get home at 10:00 pm or something like that if you go back to CDS. So yeah, just being aware of what those cycles are.
TIM BAKER: Yeah. If you could give us a little bit of like a slice of life for what a MS student is like? What would a day in the life be for you?
STEPHEN ROY: Well, I am probably not the most typical student, but I’ll just give a day in the life for me. Usually I’ll find myself coming in to CDS four days, potentially five days a week. It’s not every day. Usually I try and avoid Fridays for the exact opposite reason that most people try to make it on Fridays, which is that is when all of the job fairs and career fairs are. I already have a… I know where I’m going when I leave the program. I don’t need to go job hunting. I can’t go job hunting. So Fridays, which don’t have academic classes, they’re mainly focused on either having project group meetings or having a career fair opportunity, will be a day that I just there’s no point of coming in and I’ll avoid it for the most part.
For the other days, Monday through Thursday, I usually try to be in before noon. Most classes will start, the earliest, I believe I had classes routinely was right around 1:00 pm. Sometimes there are some earlier ones, but it’s very rare. You have the morning to figure out what you’re doing. The best reason to be in before noon is that there are a lot of discussions and talks that CDS will put on during the lunch hour. And even if you don’t necessarily enjoy or have a reason to go listen to a particular talk, CDS does a good job of luring students in with a table spread for lunch or something like that. So most people will at least come in to grab some snacks or food, which it’s pretty effective. People will at least drop by and be in the atmosphere and listen to what people are talking about, which is good to broaden your horizons even if you’re not completely engrossed in that particular talk of the day.
But yeah, I try to get in before noon. Usually do some prep for the first class that I have or the next class that I have, depending on how far ahead or behind I am. You’ll go to a class. Usually you’ll have—it depends on your course load—you’ll have two, maybe two, one and a half. Every class will have a class and then a recitation or a lab or something like that. So you figure there will be either three classes or four classes for most students. And I’m going in about four days a week, so do the math. That’s how many how many classes you’ll have. Usually I end up being one of the later folks to leave, because I will find it very productive to come back to CDS after classes and work on homeworks and talk through problems.
And just, there’s usually a fairly strong group of folks from your class who are doing the exact same thing you are. So, it’ll be pretty productive to just work through it as a group and bounce ideas off of each other. Where somebody’s struggling, somebody else probably has figured that out. And for all the different classes, the folks who you will have as your go-to will change. For math, I was not a go-to person at all. Last time I had dealt with math, it was very, it was before some of my classmates even went to college. So, that wasn’t my strong area. But when we started going into things like big data and how our data centers operate, well, I have been doing that for my job for several years, so I had some insights that were very useful for that particular class. And there’s some give and take for everybody.
But to kind of just roll that up real quick, I try to go in before noon, do a little bit of work. Maybe I’d work through the lunch lecture, maybe I would listen to it, go to class, come back to CDS after class because most classes aren’t at CDS. I say CDS like it’s a building because it kind of is both a department and a building. It’s for Masters students in Data Science, your home. And after working however late I want to work that evening, some nights later, if there is a homework due. Some nights I go home earlier if there is no reason to stay too late and then I’d come home. That would be the routine. Before going into school, guess your standard whatever your morning routine is. I like to run. Not very many people like to run. So, it’s whatever you do in your mornings. And then the weekends, pretty free unless you’re backlogged on homework.
TIM BAKER: OK. So I mean, it sounds like you have a bit of like a work-life balance figured out with your time at CDS.
STEPHEN ROY: Yeah, I think that’s fair. I spend a lot more time than I’d like to on the…specifically working through homeworks. And part of that just comes because I’m or at least I was, a little bit out of the habit of doing homeworks and thinking on new problems. Most of the problems I’ve been dealing with are things I’ve dealt with before. And academics, it’s a different mindset than work. So, do I think I have a work-life balance? I don’t know that you can really have a work-life balance while you’re going through grad school. I probably haven’t really found it, but I certainly do spend time doing other things. Yeah, work-life balance is interesting. I think more important is overall happiness. And general, are you content and satisfied with what you’re doing? Because that for me is just as important as having a work-life balance. If you really enjoy school, then throw yourself into it. You’ll be perfectly fine either way. If you want to go out and hang out with people outside of school, there are opportunities to do that. There will be a lot of times when you can go hang out with folks. Fewer organized events at night, but they do occur. And a lot of the students will put stuff together even if there isn’t anything planned. So, yeah, as long as you aren’t burning yourself out, I think you’ll be fine. The work-life balance is what you make of it.
TIM BAKER: Great. Are you doing any research at all while you’re at CDS?
STEPHEN ROY: Nope.
TIM BAKER: No?
STEPHEN ROY: I’m not really focused heavily on any of the research at the moment.
TIM BAKER: OK.
STEPHEN ROY: I spend a lot more of my time trying to just… So I felt very fortunate to receive a lot of time and assistance and energy from fellow classmates talking through some of the classes in the first semester. So I’ve tried to give back a lot of that on the classes in the second semester since I’ve found them relatively easier. Maybe not easy, but definitely not as difficult. So it’s for me a lot more investing time in relationships with other people and trying to be able to better describe and explain things in different ways that maybe I hadn’t thought about them before.
TIM BAKER: OK. So, we’re kind of in the final thoughts now. I guess ultimately, why did you end up choosing CDS versus the other program that you applied for? What was your big reason for coming to CDS? You had mentioned earlier, you know, it was in New York, you wanted to live in New York, but?
STEPHEN ROY: Convenience of location. I had mentioned my folks live in upstate New York. My sister lives down in DC. I’m pretty well situated between both of them to go visit folks and it would be a relatively new experience for me. Everything lined up pretty well for NYU and it was what I was kind of looking for in a program. The biggest things were in-state, in-person, and had a good—by my own subjective standards of good—program. And NYU really checked those blocks and CDS in particular. That all really, I can’t boil it down to anything, you know, this was the one specific thing that worked out the best for me. It was just a combination of factors. Yeah. At the end of the day, figured out that would be where I hang my hat.
TIM BAKER: OK, excellent. What would you recommend, what’s one thing that you would recommend that all people do once they come to New York?
STEPHEN ROY: My answer will probably be very different from most folks. I think one of the best parts about New York City is just how, and to a smaller extent NYU, is how much of the world you can see in such a small area. New York City is very diverse. Some people will tell you to go hit the big attractions that any tourist will see, you know, Broadway or the Statue of Liberty or whatever. Those are great. You can do that in a weekend, that’s easy. I think if you have the time, something that will benefit anybody is to just try and see the different sub parts of the city, the different ethnic markets, the different maybe some of the more rundown sides. Just see how different people live and different people are surviving in a city that is one of the largest in the world. And by seeing how other people go and experience life in a place that is very close to you but very far culturally, I think has a lot of value. And opening your eyes to what is out there. So I would say something I would encourage. Maybe take a few friends that if you feel uncomfortable going alone, but try and see a part of the city that you have no reason to go to and you probably would otherwise avoid.
TIM BAKER: Excellent. And then the final question, just any final advice that you might have for Fall 2021 applicants?
STEPHEN ROY: CDS right now, GSAS the graduate school right now, doesn’t have a lot of good options to defer. It doesn’t have a great option right now to. There is potentially an option to postpone coming until the spring. A lot of uncertainty is floating around because of the current state, uncertainty about how will COVID be in the fall? Will we come back? Will it, you know, life go back to normal? What will happen, especially for international students, if we can’t have in-person classes? Will you have to leave the country? Will you be able to stay? In all that uncertainty, I guess the advice that I would have, put a lot of careful thought into where are you at in life right now? Are you at a point where it makes sense to continue working and build your skills and apply again? Are you at a point where it makes sense to, you know what, you need to go to school to progress? And even if it’s online, which I personally prefer less than in-person. Despite the best efforts of instructors and classes and technology, you lose something. People lose something by not having the full ability to communicate. We have so many subtle cues that we can pick up on by seeing somebody in person and watching how they react and what are… You may not see on Zoom if somebody winces because of your question because you know that question doesn’t really hit the mark. There are things you’ll miss.
Personally, I am going to be back in the fall. I have a fixed timeline and I’ve already started and I’m going to be done with my degree next May come high or hell water, so it makes sense for me to continue. But if you are in a good place with a job, which is not something everybody can say right now. Perhaps even if you’ve already been accepted, if you’ve been accepted, there is a pretty good chance that you are the type of person NYU wants and it may be in your best interest to think about whether stability now is better or whether progressing your education is better. And nobody but you can answer that question. So, that’s something that I’m sure everybody is taking a long hard look at right now. And it’s probably the most important thing to look at because nobody has an idea of what the fall semester will hold. Probably easier for people in the US to make a less (INAUDIBLE) decision, but for international students especially. Yeah, that’s a tough one to work through.
TIM BAKER: Yeah. And it seems to be changing every day.
STEPHEN ROY: Yeah.
TIM BAKER: Thank you so much for your time. I appreciate it.
STEPHEN ROY: No problem.
TIM BAKER: Thank you for listening to the CDS Admissions podcast. The music for the podcast was composed by the instrumental artist Cryptic One. You can find his work at crypticone.bandcamp.com.